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Can Squidoo-HubPages Do This? NO (Includes How To File an IC3)

By Edited Oct 27, 2014 5 30
Tapping a Pencil
Credit: Rennett Stowe on flickr / Licensed under Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 Generic

Before You Go to HubPages

Consider what you are giving away

Yesterday, around 5 pm on Friday, August 15th, 2014, Seth Godin announced that "HubPages is acquiring key content from Squidoo."[1]

Guess who owns that key content? Writers (not Squidoo). It states that in their own Terms of Service[2] (TOS):

The content: who owns it?

As a Lensmaster, you will be able to incorporate various forms of Content into your Lenses. Squidoo does not claim ownership of the Content you place on your Lens. The Content will be owned by you or a third party from whom you got permission to post the content.
Warning: As soon as you accept a "forced" transfer of your work to HubPages, you are a willing participant. Therefore, I am writing this to give you time to think about the facts (and potential legalities) before you decide how your content should be profited from and by whom.
I am a writer.
Credit: David Turnbull on flickr / Licensed under Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 Generic

What is Ethical and Fair

Writers on Squidoo deserve to be paid any (and all) monies earned from their lenses. They deserve and are legally entitled to be paid right up until the last day that their content is posted online (or Squidoo's last day online).

By deleting a Squidoo account before September, writers will lose both July's (and almost all of) August's earnings. This is theft - writers will have earned money for Squidoo for these two months will not be paid it unless they agree to a forced transfer of their work.

Thousands of high quality pages (which do not belong to Squidoo) are part of the "sale" of Squidoo to HubPages. Our work is NOT Squidoo's to sell. Our content should not be bartered (without our express permission first) in this entire transaction.

We own our work.

How much will Seth Godin and associated parties make from selling our content to HubPages?

Exactly. No one knows.

It Gets Worse

Reading through the fine print (and cleverly worded FAQ[3] page) I discovered a few more "potential" problems you should be aware of:

Squidoo states: "We do have some partners that send us small payments late, and those, along with payments below the threshold [of $25], will be donated to the Acumen Fund."

Now I ask you fellow (or former) lensmasters:

  • Why would "some partners" even bother to pay on time now? They know Squidoo is selling out.
  • What exactly is a "small" payment ($100, $3, $500, $1,000)?
  • When did we (as lensmasters) agree that anything under $25 was to be donated (allegedly) to the Acumen Fund?
  • What exactly is deemed the "highest rated" and "most useful" content? Content that makes the most money for the writing platform [HubPages, Squidoo] or for the writer (who owns it)? 

Wonder why the push to "set up" your HubPages account?

As soon as you are a willing participant in this grand plan, you'll lose any legal recourse to get your content back. And Squidoo will stand to make even more money from your work.

I'm certain the timing (Friday at 5 pm, last two weeks of August) was intentional.

With the flurry of people on holidays, preparing their kids for back-to-school, Seth Godin with the HubPages executives are sitting back waiting to see "how many" lensmasters take the bait.

In jurisprudence, this looks like coercion

while under duress. Sadly, rms works for Squidoo:

Squidoo and HubPages Comments Section
Credit: RoseWrites on InfoBarrel / All rights reserved

My August 18th, 2014 Squidoo Payout Statement

Hmmm, if everyone is owed $20, how much does the Acumen Fund (which Seth Godin is an advisor for) get?

Screenshot of sousababy's money held in reserve
Credit: RoseWrites on InfoBarrel / All rights reserved

Don't Throw Your Pearls

Seth Godin seems to feel he is acting in the lensmasters' best interests.


Oh, I think that when the payment threshold was moved to $25, Seth Godin knew exactly what he was going to do.

If every writer has $5 or $10 or $24.99 "donated" to the Acumen Fund (or wherever), that will add up to a lot of money.

Oh and do you think that HubPages pays writers more?


InfoBarrel does. In fact, with InfoBarrel, writers can earn even more than 75% revenue share. With contests, writers can earn bonuses ($100, $50, $25).

Plus, each article submitted to InfoBarrel's editorial calendar increases your ad share for the next month by 1% (to a maximum of 5%). 

How Points Work on InfoBarrel

There is no lensrank system on InfoBarrel. Article scores are determined by InfoBarrel's own algorithm (and human editors read the work submitted).

  1. You get 1 point for an article which scores 41 or higher (which is 500 or more words).
  2. You get 2 points for an article which scores 41 or higher (which is 800 or more words).
  3. You get 5 points for an article which scores 41 or higher (which is 1000 or more words).

And Wow, There are Bonus Percentages

  1. If you achieve more than 30 points, you get 85% of the Adsense Share.
  2. If you achiever more than 20 points, you get 80% of the Adsense Share.

So, you can even make 90% Ad Share

By submitting 5 articles in the month to the editorial calendar (remember, they need to "fit" the topic you submit them to - or they won't count), you can increase your ad share to a maximum of 5% more.

What about Amazon?

Oh I almost forgot, you earn 100% of your Amazon revenue (whatever percentage Amazon permits) when you use plain Amazon text links in your article on InfoBarrel.

Addendum August 16th, 2014: claudslewis explained in the comments below: 

If you use the Amazon modules on IB you do share a small percentage of earnings through them. The way this works is that the modules show the writer's ID 75% to 90% of the time and the rest is with IB's ID. If you use plain Amazon text links you get 100%.

InfoBarrel uses your author ID 75 to 90% of the time and 10 to 25% is with InfoBarrel's ID when you use the Amazon Product module. Just make sure that your affiliate code is in your settings on InfoBarrel (in your advertising profile).

Want to Learn More About InfoBarrel?

I highly recommend classicalgeek's article A Newbie's Guide to Publishing on InfoBarrel.

DebW07's article titled How to Get Featured on The Homepage of InfoBarrel.

My comparison of the two platforms (this is a 100% charity article): InfoBarrel Or Squidoo | Why I Prefer InfoBarrel.

InfoBarrel is Getting a Complete Overhaul

InfoBarrels admin avatar (in a tux)
On July 11th, 2014 InfoBarrel's admin, affectionately known as Mr. Serious White Cat (shown at right) posted Exciting News about InfoBarrel V4.0.

Wondering about article scores? I did too.

These are only shown to authors (the public doesn't see them). They appear as a number in a box at the end of your article's title. So far, almost all of my articles start out with a score between 60 and 66 (in green) and increase with social sharing and interaction. On February 20th, 2013, InfoBarrel's admin posted Introducing Scoring For Articles

Oh my, Bonnie and Seth visited me (and others)

After 4 yrs on Squidoo, I know who dropped by. Thanks!

Google Analytics screenshot showing Mentor, New York, Orlando (multiple visits)
Credit: RoseWrites on InfoBarrel / All rights reserved

August 19th, 2014 at 7:35 pm ET

Bonnie Diczhazy emailed me the following:


Thanks for your feedback, and of course, our hope is that people will find exactly the right platform to put their work going forward.

Here are the updated FAQ's too [URL].

A screenshot of the notable changes are shown next.

Screenshot of Revised FAQ (Squidoo and HubPages)
Credit: RoseWrites on InfoBarrel

Final Thoughts

I want to thank everyone who visited and shared this article. I firmly believe that without bringing these issues to light, that this may never have been rectified. I also discovered on Seth's Blog Squidthanks that he wrote: 

Last week, we announced HubPages is acquiring the key assets of Squidoo and HugDug.

I never contributed to HugDug, but I did a search of the original announcement and the word HugDug never came up. A friend of mine (formerly on Squidoo) just deleted all of his HugDug articles.

Only time will tell if Squidoo has actually ended their relationship with content owners - the writers - on a good note.

My final response to Bonnie Diczhazy?

Wise, but too bad this wasn't addressed sooner.

Author's note: In the back of my mind I wonder if that big green transfer button was clicked on enough times for Seth et al. to secure the deal with HubPages (of course, we'll never know the details). I reported unethical practices on Squidoo numerous times - unfortunately, most of these reports were met with indifference or worse.

I have chosen to no longer visit, share, like or support any work that contains URLs with the domain names Squidoo, HugDug or HubPages (or anything related to these sites). I am in the process of deleting all such pins from my Pinterest boards.

Both Seth Godin and Paul Edmondson knew Squidoo's Terms of Service. They both knew the content belongs to each individual writer. They caused much grief, unrest, and needless worry to hundreds of honest writers. There's no "good note" for me.

A Screenshot of the Newly Revised FAQ

Newly revised FAQ Squidoo and HubPages
Credit: RoseWrites on InfoBarrel

Data (aka Content) not moved until September

Therefore, it must be okay to close accounts Aug. 31st

Based on commentary in InfoBarrel's forum thread, I felt it wise to add another screenshot of the newly revised Squidoo and HubPages Transition FAQ (shown above).

Since I will be on vacation soon (up until about 11 pm ET August 31st, 2014). I plan to leave my Squidoo account "as is" and delete everything by midnight on August 31st, 2014.

That way, I can collect my share of earnings (my maximum earnings) that I split 50 - 50 with Squidoo for all of July and August 2014. Of course, my earnings are held in trust by other parties right now, I understand.

Since it states that "your data will be moved automatically to HubPages in September" (remember your data includes your content - which you own).  It stands to reason that lensmasters can delete everything on August 31st, 2014 by midnight ET.

What will you be doing with your content on Squidoo?

Addendum October 27th, 2014

You can file an IC3 report (free of charge, without a lawyer). By doing so, you may get some or all of your deserved income back and no longer be "held to" any Terms of Use at HubPages. I have provided screenshot proof and pertinent links and quotes in my article Regret Your HubPages-Squidoo Transfer or Content Deletion? Help to Get Your Earnings Back.

My latest article, Is HubPages Hanging Squids Out to Dry? takes a look at how Google's Panda, Penguin, and Pirate updates may be impacting HubPages.

Will you be boycotting domain names with Squidoo, HupPages and HugDug too? Are you going to publish your work elsewhere or on your own blog/sites? Let me know in the comments below. Take good care, Rose



Aug 16, 2014 12:41pm
I'm not sure how anyone can go along with this decision to move to HubPages. With the obvious deception and the manipulativeness of this sudden announcement, and as you pointed out, the various forms of theft, I don't see how anyone who was on Squidoo would want to do anything other than take all their content away from these people. I can see some letting it all go to HubPages for now due to having too many lenses to do anything with - but I hope many will take their work elsewhere ASAP. I'm so glad I know about InfoBarrel, and will be putting many of my Squidoo lenses here.
Aug 16, 2014 12:47pm
Agreed. I honestly fail to see how Squidoo has proven themselves to be acting in the best interest of lensmasters. The right thing to do is respect the content as being owned by the authors who wrote it, give appropriate notice of when the platform will no longer be online, promise to (and follow through) on paying every writer what s/he earned up until the last day. It's fine to "recommend" HubPages to writers - but it's NOT okay to force such a transaction (by default) nor withhold earnings from writers for deleting their accounts/lenses. Our content should NEVER have been on the bargaining table in this deal where Seth Godin et al. will make ? money from.
Aug 16, 2014 8:16pm
Good points! A small correction though. If you use the Amazon modules on IB you do share a small percentage of earnings through them. The way this works is that the modules show the writer's ID 75% to 90% of the time and the rest is with IB's ID. If you use plain Amazon text links you get 100%
Aug 16, 2014 8:20pm
Oh thank you claudslewis for correcting me on that (it's still a fairer, more transparent system on here than on other sites). Sorry for my mistake everyone.
Aug 16, 2014 8:31pm
An addendum has been added to that section of my article. Thank you once again claudslewis.
Aug 17, 2014 1:34am
Good points Rose. You gave me more to think about. I'm not surprised Squidoo is going out of business, but the way this has been handled is really bad. And to do it now, when people are on holidays or getting their kids ready for school? Not even an email! You only find out from logging in to the dashboard.
Aug 17, 2014 9:28am
Yeah, I was told by TanoCalvenoa - I had no idea. I'm sure this was timed such that frantic people would simply "accept" the transfer (so they don't lose traffic).

The thing is, once you begin to initiate the process, you agreed to "sell" your work to HubPages. But, the only people getting paid for the top content on Squidoo is Seth et. al.

How do I know? Because HP users need to open a separate account (so HP execs can see what they are "buying" from Seth). And, there's no guarantee that this content will remain online (to benefit the writer).

It may simply be a way to "add" to HP's overall traffic. If they delete your work on HP - guess what? Seth made money off it and the writer sees zero (and doesn't get paid in the future on HP).

A class action suit might be in order (IF enough Squidoo people do not "buy into" this scam). Unfortunately, the well-calculated timing of this HAS already caused people to hit that "start transfer" button - good people (who, a few months from now, may have their content deleted or not featured on HP because of THEIR Terms of Service).
Aug 17, 2014 8:10pm
NEW info: Seth Godin is an advisor for the Acumen Fund. Here's your proof: http://acumen.org/about/people/advisors/

Wonder if this is something that should be reported? Thanks to InfoBarrel writer MaggieMurphy for letting me know and posting this: Go here for information on how to report concerns to the appropriate agencies: www.justice.gov/criminal/cybercrime/reporting.html

BTW, Squidoo's address is: Squidoo, LLC, Headquarters
3 W Main St. Ste 103
Irvington, NY 10533-3503
United States (and the authorities can directly go after Seth Godin).

There appears to be a rumour circulating that "Squidoo is incorporated in Panama and cannot face any consequences."
Aug 18, 2014 7:31am
NEW: Purportedly, the "Best Of" Squidoo lenses are the ones chosen by Seth et al. to SELL (yes, sell YOUR content) to HubPages. Everyone else doing this transfer - or even just visiting and checking out HubPages - is merely ADDING to HubPages' overall traffic (increasing their Alexa ranking). Yeah, most of you are being used (and will not get 1 penny for your time and effort).

My suggestion (and what I am doing): Leave just ONE of your lenses up on Squidoo (DO NOT delete your account). This way, Squidoo MUST pay you for July and Aug. earnings (which also made money for Squidoo).

DO NOT hit that green transfer button - by doing so, you've accepted this illegal sale of your work. IF Squidoo moves your ONE lens - it is theft. Remember, you own your content (Squidoo does not).

Furthermore, I refuse to visit or support anything written on HubPages (sorry). The CEO of HubPages also knows Squidoo's TOS (and knows that this is theft of your work).
Aug 19, 2014 8:47am
I'm with you on this and wrote a couple of articles myself. The one thing everyone seems to be missing, though, is that the date of the 29th seems to have been picked because, if you delete your account by then to avoid the transfer, you sacrifice all of your earnings, everything in your hopper. You may think it's worth it to poke Seth Godin in the face, but that's not what happens. What you sacrifice, he gets. There is no guarantee even that it will go to the Acumen Fund, which you accurately point out he is featured and promoted on as an Advisor. Maybe he'll split it up with his loyal partners who helped keep a mask over the scam, i.e., Bonnie, Robin, Cory and Gil.
Aug 19, 2014 9:37am
I wasn't missing the August 29th thing Dave - nor were other writers on Squidoo. HQ has just refused to answer (or ignored) people who pointed it out.

It was clearly intentional to announce this on a Friday at 5 pm ET. Seth Godin could have chosen "by Sept 1st" (which is the right thing to do). He's forcing a transfer of lensmasters' work and retaining earnings UNTIL you click some link (to activate your account at HubPages).

It's illegal to: A) Move content (by default) that doesn't belong to you. (We own our content).
B) Sell said content to a third party (without the content owner's express permission).
C) Keep earnings for July and August if someone does NOT delete their account.

I plan to keep one lens up. If Squidoo moves it, it is theft. If they withhold my earnings for July and/or August it is also theft. (I never had an affiliate Amazon account on Squidoo, I split everything 50% with them).

I have $20 in the reserve hopper.

Interestingly enough, on Wikipedia it states: "the aim is to relocate some of Squidoo's content to its new home at HubPages by October 1, 2014."

First of all "some of Squidoo's content" is not for Squidoo to claim ownership of or relocate. If October 1st, 2014 is that deadline that Squidoo will be working on this -- then it stands to reason that:

Squidoo should (and is legally bound) to pay anyone all monies owed for July and August - even if they cannot do so, until Oct. 1st. (I'll be expecting Seth to pay me my $20 by Oct. 1st, otherwise he may face a class action suit).
Aug 19, 2014 10:39am
To whoever it was that left me a nasty message (I forgot to check your avatar to report you):

To answer you:

The right thing to do would have been to seek out how many writers WANTED to transfer their work to HubPages FIRST.

Seth Godin has no right to claim it as "Squidoo's content."

Secondly, it's wrong to withhold earnings until some button is pushed (be it the green transfer button on the dash OR to activate a new account on HubPages).

I helped to earn money for Squidoo for July and (almost all) of August. I split 50% with them. It's illegal to withhold my earnings should I choose to leave my account open until the last day.

Unlike others, I have always sought out solid proof and have provided it openly.

A lawyer (and judge) would probably agree with me.
Aug 21, 2014 2:38pm
I left a comment about the cashout threshold in the comments section of the HQ News articles and was intrigued to see I wasn't the only one thinking the same thing. 2 years and 4 months I have been on the site.

Changes started to come in starting the the rank cutoff being at 300K. Later came the rank cutoff at 170K shortly followed by a cashout min of 25USD. To make matters worse they were constantly changing things and posting quests up for people to do like things were business as usual.

After the site update of stripping CSS from lenses, changing the layout from manageable to large type we get an announcement that they're changing hands. Of course in order to see this news you have to sign into your account.

After checking back with the forums some were saying that the threshold was moved back down to a dollar (in shock after reading this) but saw a post from someone that said their threshold was still at 25USD. Haven't gotten a response as of yet from anyone that can clarify this.

Thanks for sharing this article. Still reeling since I'm trying to figure out where to put my content or if I even want to republish all of it elsewhere. So far, three of my works have been posted elsewhere with a fourth in the works of being combined with another active topic.
Aug 21, 2014 2:47pm
Well, since I've saved a screenshot of the newly revised FAQ payment which clearly states "we're lowering the monthly threshold to $1" I think Squidoo would be foolish to try and do otherwise (perhaps your friend hasn't cleared his or her cache).

I wish you well with your own sites/platforms and here on InfoBarrel.

I'm advising people to boycott (and not support) any URL with Squidoo, HubPages, or HugDug in it. This has been a disgraceful way to treat content owners. Many people have been emailing me that they haven't sleep at night, etc. Terrible. I really feel for you and those like you.

Take good care,
Aug 21, 2014 9:17pm
This information came very much last minute. Still working on my first post for this site. Thanks for the follow up.
Aug 21, 2014 9:22pm
No problem, welcome aboard. Be sure to check out classicalgeek's newbie guide (she answers every conceivable question in there and provides excellent video tutorials (with text).
Aug 28, 2014 1:14pm
There's a correction to the amount of time I've been on the site. I've actually been on Squidoo for 2 years and 14 days; day 14 being the day I cleared all my stuff off the site.
Aug 23, 2014 1:28pm
As an observer, not a participant in the Squidoo/HubPages buyout, I'm just here to comment that your thorough research and coverage of the matter is very beneficial to the writers, and in support of not supporting shady, underhanded, money-grubbing people, resolve to NOT visit any url with a squiddo or hubpages in it.
Aug 23, 2014 9:24pm
Wow, thank you for such a supportive comment. Seems plenty of Squidoo writers are too afraid to come forth and demand to be paid for: 1) their share of the ad pool 2) Amazon earnings 3) eBay earnings and 4) some partners who pay "small amounts" late (whatever a small amount is to a millionaire I don't know - $5, $1000, $100?) IF they delete their entire account (like me) on August 31st, 2014 by midnight ET.

Oh and the drama is unfolding on my Google Plus page - seems Larry Addison (who attended Harvard Law School, at least according to his profile page) left me a message stating: "You are a strange person...........".

I'm guessing he's Seth Godin's attorney trying to bully and intimidate me.
Aug 26, 2014 6:59pm
So for me it's not the last few days of earnings on Squidoo. I wrote articles there as a means to earn passive income over many years. I've made a few bucks but having my content sold to another site, and the need to become a member, have it screened, blah, blah, blah didn't seem to pop up in the Terms of Service. I know I worked my ass off to get !00% and "thumbs up, pal" and then had articles revert to "works in progress," goading me to make improvements to perfectly good material (presumably to satisfy some mysterious set of criteria that the "good job, pal" or whatever it said didn't cover. I didn't invest a lot of energy in Squidoo but some of the stuff I wrote was just fine. I'll let you in on a secret. I'm a professional writer. I have made hundreds of thousands of dollars from my brain and a word processor. And I sucked it up and fooled with my "lenses" many of which were deleted for no reason I could discern.
It wasn't in the TOS or anywhere else, but the tacit agreement was that if I could get a lens on Squidoo, and promote it (which I totally know how to do, and did), I could get a trickle of income from my writing.
Seth's message announcing the sale was a soothing as the commands to cattle getting on a truck to market.
I'm a strange person, too. And, hey Larry Addison, if you want to switch sides and start a class action suit I can offer you some real info, from a real writer, who makes $100 an hour. Squidoo was all fun and cute and all. But there is gold in them there words. I think some of us knew that going in.
Aug 26, 2014 7:28pm
This comment has been deleted.
Aug 26, 2014 7:30pm
Yeah, I agree with your line, "Seth's message announcing the sale was a soothing as the commands to cattle getting on a truck to market."

If possession is 9/10ths of the law, then gambling on other peoples' content was a huge risk. But Seth bet on a certain percentage of lensmasters that would go along with the transfer and click that green transfer button.

Sadly, I think that's what happened.

Since the transfers aren't beginning until September (2nd, I believe Corey Brown said), I see no reason why people cannot be paid their share of the ad pool for August (nor any late payments).

I don't mind receiving a payment late - do you?
Aug 26, 2014 8:59pm
Well, the button is big and GREEN. Who can resist. But I bet Seth will still go around blowing his mouth off about building a tribe, then harnessing it, then selling it. Chuckle.
Aug 26, 2014 9:11pm
HA! Yeah. And did you notice how the other staff only responded to the positive comments on the posts about this (ignoring or angrily answering others using vague, winding explanations that didn't address questions directly).

And I'm sure other people were banned for commenting or had their concerns deleted. I noticed that Corey Brown's latest post has significantly fewer media likes, etc. (even less than my article).
Aug 28, 2014 12:59pm
Oh I took keen note of that. I was hoping to see a response or to on posts asking questions in regards to payout and why content can't be merged into already existing accounts was interesting to see.

Sure they helped in all but continue on they way they were all while encouraging participation quests knowing that something was going down. Oh and that question I posted on their FB page...still unanswered and still at the top spot of the Aug 18 post.
Aug 26, 2014 7:38pm
Addendum: My time spent writing is worth money. The mechanism Squidoo offers to reclaim my property, doesn't. If you download the HTML code, you have to spend a long time fooling around to strip out Squidoo material to make it presentable on a WordPress format. And forget about the photos. Forget about them. You will have to find them and upload them. The Amazon links, well, those don't work. Fortunately I have EasyAzon, but it still takes time. It took me a couple of hours to refurbish one lens for posting, and I did it out of stubborn determination not to have my work sold out. Keep track of your hours, cattle.
Aug 26, 2014 7:46pm
I learned long ago to save my work after every lens I wrote (and the photos as well) but I know there are others who are staying up all night and day trying to salvage their work.

I don't understand why people cannot access their work up until the last minute that Squidoo is online? And especially if they aren't hitting the transfer button (like me) - what's the rush? (I suppose it's to save on paying these people for their ad pool share and "late" payments).
Aug 26, 2014 8:44pm
This comment has been deleted.
Aug 26, 2014 8:57pm
Oops. It's almost as though Squidoo knew this day would come. From the TOS: "By accepting these terms, you waive your right to go to court and you explicitly waive your right to participate in a class action lawsuit." Well, shucks, there you go. It's wrote down and everything. It would take some lawyer to get around that right there.
Aug 26, 2014 9:23pm
I went through Squidoo's TOS with a fine toothed comb - this must've been a recent development and certainly would NOT be applicable to those who joined earlier (such as I did in 2010) nor others. Plus, I never read in their TOS that Squidoo could withhold earnings from writers for their share of the ad pool nor for any "late" payment (however small it would be).

Gee I have a friend that owes me $400 and if he pays me back late I won't say "Nah, too late, don't want my money now."
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  1. Seth Godin "Squidoo and HubPages." Squidoo. 15/08/2014. 16/08/2014 <Web >
  2. SquidTeam "Getting Started With Squidoo (The official overview, FAQ and TOS)." Squidoo. 16/08/2014 <Web >
  3. "Squidoo and HubPages Transition FAQ." Squidoo. 16/08/2014 <Web >

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